Official Takeover Thread

Discuss any news,views and opinions on Dundalk F.C.

Moderators: Duffman, Colin Gallagher

dundalkfc1903
1st Team Regular
1st Team Regular
Posts: 3590
Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2007 4:27 pm
Has thanked: 39 times
Been thanked: 45 times

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Postby dundalkfc1903 » Wed Nov 29, 2017 10:25 am

Johnny Guitar wrote:I think the lads return is irrelevant though. It's the bona fides of the new guys.



I disagree, money clouds judgement. Paul and Andy might think this sale is a brilliant idea, influenced, consciously or not, by the idea of having a few extra 000's in their bank balance.



User avatar
Louth4sam
1st Team Regular
1st Team Regular
Posts: 3456
Joined: Sun Sep 12, 2004 1:33 pm
Location: Dun Laoghaire
Has thanked: 107 times
Been thanked: 51 times
Contact:

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Postby Louth4sam » Wed Nov 29, 2017 10:30 am

Ezeikial wrote:I am alarmed by the reaction here so far. Only Conroy and dundalkfc1903 raise any scepticism about something we know next to nothing about.


I think people are skeptical Ezeikial, but there is a feeling that there is not a lot we can do. I've heard that the buyout will be €3M which is a great return for the two lads as they have probably done what nobody has done before and actually made a profit on a LOI investment.

I'd echo some of the sentiments that we are losing the passion of the two lads and unless we get the right people on board the club will lose more than just owners
"This is not only a point to make headlines, it is the truth. Football on artificial turf is the future." - FIFA president Sepp Blatter

Johnnybegood33
Youth Team
Youth Team
Posts: 72
Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2017 7:58 pm
Has thanked: 2 times
Been thanked: 5 times

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Postby Johnnybegood33 » Wed Nov 29, 2017 10:59 am

If this consortium demolish Oriel Park and build a new state of the art stadium that will be there for all time , what is wrong with that. Be optimistic.

grayzer
1st Team Regular
1st Team Regular
Posts: 2354
Joined: Tue Nov 18, 2008 4:14 pm
Has thanked: 26 times
Been thanked: 8 times

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Postby grayzer » Wed Nov 29, 2017 11:35 am

Hard to get optimistic as much as I want to be....

We've seen it happen with Cork here close to home and across the channel many clubs have been completely screwed over. Two greedy yanks were days away from almost causing the end of a massive world name in football in Liverpool FC and this crowd will have no hesitation in pulling the plug on Dundalk FC if it's not performing well in their portfolio.
In Kenny we trust.

User avatar
Louth4sam
1st Team Regular
1st Team Regular
Posts: 3456
Joined: Sun Sep 12, 2004 1:33 pm
Location: Dun Laoghaire
Has thanked: 107 times
Been thanked: 51 times
Contact:

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Postby Louth4sam » Wed Nov 29, 2017 11:36 am

Johnnybegood33 wrote:If this consortium demolish Oriel Park and build a new state of the art stadium that will be there for all time , what is wrong with that. Be optimistic.


'If'
"This is not only a point to make headlines, it is the truth. Football on artificial turf is the future." - FIFA president Sepp Blatter

User avatar
mike
Club Captain
Club Captain
Posts: 7155
Joined: Tue Apr 08, 2003 1:08 pm
Location: Iúr Cinn Trá & Ath Cliath
Has thanked: 98 times
Been thanked: 58 times

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Postby mike » Wed Nov 29, 2017 11:38 am

Would it really only cost 3M, I would have valued the club closer to 5m, as you have to include cash at bank too. The current owners 100% deserve a profit though as they put money in when no one else would touch it, not to mention the sheer hard work and stress before during and after.

On the takeover, its hard to form an opinion without having much information on the actual details within, but this is a privately owned company (DFC) so they can proceed as they wish without consultation.

My fears of any nuclear style disaster are slightly allayed by the fact that the two owners are also Dundalk supporters and you would have to trust their judgement that the deal is also a good one for the future health of the football club, but there is a worry, of course there is.

Will the new guys invest properly in facilities, or just the team, are they hoping for another 2016 season and to make the same monies that we saw by reaching the EL group stage. There are going to plenty of questions, I just don’t think we might get the answers.

I’d be cautiously optimistic but I`d also agree with Johnny above, IF oriel can be demolished (and gradually rebuilt), well that’s definitely something to look forward to.

dundalkfc1903
1st Team Regular
1st Team Regular
Posts: 3590
Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2007 4:27 pm
Has thanked: 39 times
Been thanked: 45 times

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Postby dundalkfc1903 » Wed Nov 29, 2017 11:49 am

mike wrote:
My fears of any nuclear style disaster are slightly allayed by the fact that the two owners are also Dundalk supporters and you would have to trust their judgement that the deal is also a good one for the future health of the football club, but there is a worry, of course there is.

.


How can you fully trust the judgement of someone who is going to make a 7 digit return? Some people would sell their own children into slavery for that money.
And do you think Peak6 are going to give Andy and Paul guarantees about how they are going to run the club in the future? Do you not think that once the deal is signed, Peak6 wont give two flying fcuks what Andy & Paul want?
There is simply no profit to be made in the league. It doesnt matter how big their pockets are, if this sole investment does not return what they expec,t then we will be cut loose. If they are banking on Europa League qualification every season, or even every 2 years, to return a profit and it is not achieved then SK will be the first head on the block. Is that what people want?
Their must be better options out there. Surely we all know that the secret to success is long term stability at board and managerial level. That is one thing we won't have now. We're doing a deal with the devil

User avatar
Johnny Guitar
1st Team Regular
1st Team Regular
Posts: 1890
Joined: Mon Nov 02, 2009 12:57 pm
Has thanked: 116 times
Been thanked: 28 times

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Postby Johnny Guitar » Wed Nov 29, 2017 12:12 pm

dundalkfc1903 wrote:
Johnny Guitar wrote:I think the lads return is irrelevant though. It's the bona fides of the new guys.



I disagree, money clouds judgement. Paul and Andy might think this sale is a brilliant idea, influenced, consciously or not, by the idea of having a few extra 000's in their bank balance.


It does but they took all the uncertain risk and rewards back in 2013 when they took over. They steadied the ship got in a great manager and we reached heights no other Irish side reached previously.
I am neither paul brown or Andy connolly so I can't comment on their reasons or justification. I wish it was to someone else (an actual person and not a fund) but there is nothing we can do.

I revert back to my previous point though is that Supporters had an unbelievable opportunity nearly 5 years ago to co own with them. There was little or no appetite for it.
Stephen Kenny's Black & White Army

Ezeikial
1st Team Regular
1st Team Regular
Posts: 3030
Joined: Wed Dec 10, 2008 1:00 am
Has thanked: 72 times
Been thanked: 153 times

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Postby Ezeikial » Wed Nov 29, 2017 1:02 pm

There is a popular perception that Oriel Park is insulated against any form of property speculation or asset manipulation by virtue of the terms of the existing lease with the Casey family.

That is a dangerous assumption.

As some Trust members are aware, before the current owners came in there was a legal strategy to manipulate beneficial ownership mooted as a possibility.
Ezeikial posts personal opinions and observations from this supporters perspective.

User avatar
shedsteve
Subs Bench
Subs Bench
Posts: 541
Joined: Sat Jan 17, 2004 11:35 am
Has thanked: 3 times
Been thanked: 14 times

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Postby shedsteve » Wed Nov 29, 2017 1:13 pm

dundalkfc1903 wrote:
mike wrote:
My fears of any nuclear style disaster are slightly allayed by the fact that the two owners are also Dundalk supporters and you would have to trust their judgement that the deal is also a good one for the future health of the football club, but there is a worry, of course there is.

.


How can you fully trust the judgement of someone who is going to make a 7 digit return? Some people would sell their own children into slavery for that money.
And do you think Peak6 are going to give Andy and Paul guarantees about how they are going to run the club in the future? Do you not think that once the deal is signed, Peak6 wont give two flying fcuks what Andy & Paul want?
There is simply no profit to be made in the league. It doesnt matter how big their pockets are, if this sole investment does not return what they expec,t then we will be cut loose. If they are banking on Europa League qualification every season, or even every 2 years, to return a profit and it is not achieved then SK will be the first head on the block. Is that what people want?
Their must be better options out there. Surely we all know that the secret to success is long term stability at board and managerial level. That is one thing we won't have now. We're doing a deal with the devil


I agree with dundalkfc1903. I worry about 100% control. Initially it was mooted as an investment/stake in DFC. Now its 100% with zero detail on the terms of the deal. If Peak 6 want to make a profit then the biggest cost will be redeveloping Oriel. Why would they bother if Tallaght could be rented out if and when needed for euro ties? Is there a clause in the deal insisting on Oriel redevelopment?
The two lads have done an amazing job - we have been blessed since they took over and brought in SK. As Dundalk supporters I am slightly surprised that it is a 100% deal as I thought they would have wanted to stay on board - it scares me that they are not staying on in some capacity.

Ezeikial
1st Team Regular
1st Team Regular
Posts: 3030
Joined: Wed Dec 10, 2008 1:00 am
Has thanked: 72 times
Been thanked: 153 times

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Postby Ezeikial » Wed Nov 29, 2017 1:20 pm

shedsteve wrote: If Peak 6 want to make a profit then the biggest cost will be redeveloping Oriel. Why would they bother if Tallaght could be rented out if and when needed for euro ties? Is there a clause in the deal insisting on Oriel redevelopment?



That is a question every right-thinking Dundalk supporter needs to ask.
Ezeikial posts personal opinions and observations from this supporters perspective.

User avatar
mike
Club Captain
Club Captain
Posts: 7155
Joined: Tue Apr 08, 2003 1:08 pm
Location: Iúr Cinn Trá & Ath Cliath
Has thanked: 98 times
Been thanked: 58 times

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Postby mike » Wed Nov 29, 2017 1:45 pm

There are plenty of questions for Dundalk supporters to be asking, but as I said before, with DFC being a private company, there may not be too many answers coming back.

Details of the actual takeover would be good to see, but will even a summary be shared I wonder, an interesting one and a point made above by shedsteve is very valid. Will they insert a clause to say any takeover must include redevelopment? Will it be acted upon ?

User avatar
White Horse
1st Team Regular
1st Team Regular
Posts: 1307
Joined: Fri Dec 15, 2006 11:57 am
Has thanked: 38 times
Been thanked: 96 times

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Postby White Horse » Wed Nov 29, 2017 2:10 pm

mike wrote:There are plenty of questions for Dundalk supporters to be asking, but as I said before, with DFC being a private company, there may not be too many answers coming back.

Details of the actual takeover would be good to see, but will even a summary be shared I wonder, an interesting one and a point made above by shedsteve is very valid. Will they insert a clause to say any takeover must include redevelopment? Will it be acted upon ?



The more clauses and restrictions that are inserted, the lower the purchase price.

I'm sure we all know which will be considered the most important.

oldfogey
1st Team Regular
1st Team Regular
Posts: 1226
Joined: Wed Nov 21, 2007 8:24 pm
Has thanked: 95 times
Been thanked: 68 times

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Postby oldfogey » Wed Nov 29, 2017 2:17 pm

I suppose I shouldn't be surprised at the amount of negativity here. People are angry about coming second to Cork and the prospect of losing up to 3 of our best players. Given what we have experienced during the most successful period in the clubs history, it's hard to see what can be improved apart from the ground.

If we had languished in mid table since the lads took over we would filletting them for their lack of ambition and welcoming new owners with open arms.

Connolly and Browne stumped up a hefty six figure sum to prevent the club from folding and put up guarantees to cover the business plan in years one and two. They convinced Stephen Kenny to come on board. If you look back over the years the attendances haven't exactly kept pace with the quality on the pitch. There may be some of you out there who feel they are entitled to more information, or indeed the right to veto the transaction, but not enough, and I don't see anybody rolling up with a cheque book.

It was no secret that Paul and Andy recognised that they had taken the club as far as it could go and sooner than expected. But, like GM before them, supporters expect owners to pour money into a charity, rather than use sound business judgement. After all, it's what got us to where we are now.

Ezeikial
1st Team Regular
1st Team Regular
Posts: 3030
Joined: Wed Dec 10, 2008 1:00 am
Has thanked: 72 times
Been thanked: 153 times

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Postby Ezeikial » Wed Nov 29, 2017 3:00 pm

oldfogey wrote:I suppose I shouldn't be surprised at the amount of negativity here. People are angry about coming second to Cork and the prospect of losing up to 3 of our best players. Given what we have experienced during the most successful period in the clubs history, it's hard to see what can be improved apart from the ground.

If we had languished in mid table since the lads took over we would filletting them for their lack of ambition and welcoming new owners with open arms.

Connolly and Browne stumped up a hefty six figure sum to prevent the club from folding and put up guarantees to cover the business plan in years one and two. They convinced Stephen Kenny to come on board. If you look back over the years the attendances haven't exactly kept pace with the quality on the pitch. There may be some of you out there who feel they are entitled to more information, or indeed the right to veto the transaction, but not enough, and I don't see anybody rolling up with a cheque book.

It was no secret that Paul and Andy recognised that they had taken the club as far as it could go and sooner than expected. But, like GM before them, supporters expect owners to pour money into a charity, rather than use sound business judgement. After all, it's what got us to where we are now.


I don't see much negativity, nor would I be in favour of it - but a sceptical, cautious questioning approach from fans (clients or consumers in corporate-speak) is healthy.

There is also little, if any, criticism of Paul and Andy here, apart from speculation about the possibility of taking a profit or their motivation around the potential sale. In the absence of any specific information, speculation is inevitable.

It is not unreasonable for supporters who care passionately about the club to express concerns and reservations about something that seems to be progressing to a done deal without any real information being available.
Last edited by Ezeikial on Wed Nov 29, 2017 3:07 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Ezeikial posts personal opinions and observations from this supporters perspective.


Return to “General Discussion”



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 7 guests