Official Takeover Thread

Discuss any news,views and opinions on Dundalk F.C.

Moderators: Colin Gallagher, Duffman

Post Reply
User avatar
El Paso
1st Team Regular
1st Team Regular
Posts: 4105
Joined: Tue Dec 03, 2002 12:33 pm

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Post by El Paso » Wed Jun 03, 2020 9:24 pm

The size of the losses are concerning. It appears the YDC is a decent chunk of it. But if we can't break even on our current crowds, sponsorship, and with a bar licence and (most importantly) having a couple of rounds of Europe, we're in big trouble.

Spending is not being controlled and I'd have concerns about the amount of money spunked on certain people with nothing obvious to show for it.

Pepsi
Subs Bench
Subs Bench
Posts: 554
Joined: Thu Jan 03, 2019 10:21 pm

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Post by Pepsi » Wed Jun 03, 2020 9:25 pm

Before the people of Dundalk or Louth come out to support the club they have to realise that the football and brand in Oriel is worth it. The problem in general is an Irish one......so called football fans look at the UK, the millions on offer and support their British club of choice. It is OK to spend approx. €80-100 on an English jearsey just to be seen up da town in it....however before Dundalk have theirs on the market they are complaining about the Fyffes logo, shape, material...colour...... People will say Oriel is a dump, facilites are tripe.......too expensive. What they do not realise is that if they do not come out and support the club they will no longer have a local club to support. If locals do not support the club, there will be no reason to have a club.

I have withnessed first hand what supporting/loving a club means......a German club (company I work for sponsor it) received nearly €200K+ from their fans over the last 10-14 weeks. Fans bought virtual tickets, beer, sausages, chips.....anything on sale in the ground on match night was sold during a Zoom meeting or an online FIFA game via a virtual shop. The fans got nothing for their money but understood the club needed the help. A 4th division German club may I add.....average attendance of 10k with 4-5 Bundesliga clubs, 1 zweite Bundesliga club and 3-4 third division clubs within a 50km radius, so plenty of other options available locally. Dortmund is only 45 minutes train journey from ground to ground.....

People of Dundalk have to waken up.....Dundalk FC have a chance to do something never done before in Irish football, however if people/locally based companies are too narrow minded or tight fisted to support it, it will be like many attempts before it. If it goes wrong the town will be...."was clear from day one the Yanks would leave us high and dry or its a shite league anyway and the club was over spending. Should have build a palace and I might have gone to 2 or 3 games a year." If it goes right "My club, sure dont I know them all.......live in Oriel....."
What many people in Dundalk forget, Dundalk FC costs a lot of money to run at the level it is at today and that money has to be earned not only on the pitch but also off it and has nothing to do with cash that is/was in the bank. Instead of questioning the people running the club or the amount of cash in the bank, why they didnt put a roof here there or anywhere, the people of Dundalk should be running up to Oriel, supporting as much as they can and hoping that with that support, slowly but surely things improve. With more income, the club would be in a position to improve facilities, the team....whatever. Maybe the 6-7K+ who go to the Aviva on Cup Final day or those who want those UEFA Cup/Champions League qualifier tickets should ask themselves why they are not in Oriel for every home game or why dont they have a season ticket even if they dont use it. Why does Ireland have so many event junkies??? These are the problem...they are fans when their is an event, a day out, afternoon in the pub, otherwise they ignore the club. The club seriously needs a well organised fan club, fixed membership fee every season and members get priority on ticket sales accross the bord, merchandise etc.. LOI/Cup games maybe 5-6 tickets per member, as soon as it comes to end of season crunch games, Cup finals or European games....1 ticket per member. If you want to take your kid to Oriel...sign the wee one up to a kids membership club. People have not heard the bang yet....however be warned....Dundalk FC and their current owners will not bankroll this for much longer, something has to give. It is time for fans, the community, councilors, TDs, Senitors....locally based companies, to get behind the Dundalk FC brand. A brand which has taken so much positivity and emotions to the town over the last few years, something for the whole area to be proud of. If you are a fan, lobby every councilor, TD, Senator, MEP or the dog on the street to get that funding the club needs, the fan numbers these lads deserve. If you work for one of the big companies in town who are not sponsoring the club...ask why not and suggest they begin. Something that seriously gets on my nerves is Paypal....why are they not to be seen in Oriel, why are they not offering the club contactless payment solutions for the bar, special deal for the onlineshop if fans use their service.....there are many more.

If and it is a big if....Louth won a Leinster Senior Final or an All Ireland....we would never hear the end of it. Councilors, TDs, MEPs and dogs on the street would be demanding a measuem, streets named after players and new ground bigger than Croke Park.

(OK my rant is over...dont expect anyone to agree or disagree with me....but I had to get it off my chest, back now to drinking a nice cold one and putting my feet up)

Johnnybegood33
Subs Bench
Subs Bench
Posts: 542
Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2017 7:58 pm

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Post by Johnnybegood33 » Wed Jun 03, 2020 9:34 pm

That’s a very fair comment , El Paso, but as the only team in Louth flying the flag , with a population of 130,000 , not to mention neighbouring counties , & winning doubles & several Leagues , in my mind it was the time to knock Oriel , build a modern stadium , which Co. Louth deserves & then you might attract much bigger crowds. Good post Pepsi , all positive stuff.

Ezeikial
Club Captain
Club Captain
Posts: 7415
Joined: Wed Dec 10, 2008 1:00 am

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Post by Ezeikial » Wed Jun 03, 2020 10:55 pm

Blaming casual for not turning up more often or branding a swathe of potential supporters as 'pathetic' is unlikely to be a successful approach to attracting these people to Oriel Park.

Improving the match day experience through more cover from the rain and better sight lines might be a better strategy
Ezeikial posts personal opinions and observations from this supporters perspective.

Shoco
1st Team Regular
1st Team Regular
Posts: 1439
Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2009 11:46 pm

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Post by Shoco » Thu Jun 04, 2020 2:26 pm

El Paso wrote:
Wed Jun 03, 2020 9:11 pm
The population is 39,000. The average crowd is 2,700 which includes a number of Monday night games and some piss poor opposition. That's 7% of the population for a League of Ireland club. In fact there are about 14,000 households, so that's one person in every fifth home making the trek to Oriel.

That's very far from 'pathetic' given the entertainment choices available to people today and given the lack of anything resembling big-match infrastructure.
Only thing is, you can't use Dundalks population and assume the attendance is made up of only people from Dundalk.
Out of the lads I meet up with at games, including children, out of the 9 of us, only 1 lives in town.

User avatar
El Paso
1st Team Regular
1st Team Regular
Posts: 4105
Joined: Tue Dec 03, 2002 12:33 pm

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Post by El Paso » Thu Jun 04, 2020 2:33 pm

Fair enough, and obviously the catchment area is closer to 100K. But it was only a means for putting figures in context. If our attendances are pathetic then Leinster Rugby’s attendances (for example) are whatever’s worse than pathetic all things considered.

User avatar
seand
1st Team Regular
1st Team Regular
Posts: 2949
Joined: Mon Dec 02, 2002 12:35 pm
Location: D'Shed

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Post by seand » Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:00 pm

I'm not sure when Euro prize money hits the books, but in 2019 we would have banked at least 500K from the 2018-19 season in Europe. With ticket sales, sponsorship etc, how much are outgoings to make such a huge loss? Investment in the YDC is a capital investment, is that even counted as a loss? I'd be very concerned about where all the money is going. Wages I'm sure are higher than ever, and I think we're all ok with pishing money away on the first team! But there's hundreds of thousands slipping away with no explanation that I can see

Let's remember too that this is just the owners burning the 2016 Euro money. They haven't invested a dime yet.

Ezeikial
Club Captain
Club Captain
Posts: 7415
Joined: Wed Dec 10, 2008 1:00 am

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Post by Ezeikial » Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:53 pm

seand wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 4:00 pm

Let's remember too that this is just the owners burning the 2016 Euro money. They haven't invested a dime yet.
El Paso wrote:
Wed Jun 03, 2020 9:24 pm
The size of the losses are concerning.
Apart from the above, there seems to be very little comment about the 2019 accounts indicating growing losses and a reducing cash pile. Is it lack of concern or just a blind faith that it'll be all right on the night?

What happens when the money runs out?
Ezeikial posts personal opinions and observations from this supporters perspective.

Pepsi
Subs Bench
Subs Bench
Posts: 554
Joined: Thu Jan 03, 2019 10:21 pm

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Post by Pepsi » Thu Jun 04, 2020 5:30 pm

My question is.....do the accounts reflect Euro money earned this year??? Surely nothing has been paid out as no compitition has ended. If that is the case and taking into account the investment in the YDC, it makes it all look a little different.
If Euro money is included in the loss, then questions have to be asked.

Any word on what Bill is supposed to say in the Argus with James Rogers about Oriel upgrades. Read somewhere on Twitter that they were readying some work....

User avatar
seand
1st Team Regular
1st Team Regular
Posts: 2949
Joined: Mon Dec 02, 2002 12:35 pm
Location: D'Shed

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Post by seand » Thu Jun 04, 2020 6:19 pm

Pepsi wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 5:30 pm
My question is.....do the accounts reflect Euro money earned this year??? Surely nothing has been paid out as no compitition has ended. If that is the case and taking into account the investment in the YDC, it makes it all look a little different.
If Euro money is included in the loss, then questions have to be asked.

Any word on what Bill is supposed to say in the Argus with James Rogers about Oriel upgrades. Read somewhere on Twitter that they were readying some work....
I'm guessing Euro money for the 2018-19 season (Europa League v Levadia/AEK) would be reflected in 2019 accounts. That's a lot less that the 2019-20 Euro money, but still over 500K

dundalkfc1903
1st Team Regular
1st Team Regular
Posts: 4171
Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2007 4:27 pm

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Post by dundalkfc1903 » Thu Jun 04, 2020 7:26 pm

People of Dundalk have to waken up.....Dundalk FC have a chance to do something never done before in Irish football, however if people/locally based companies are too narrow minded or tight fisted to support it, it will be like many attempts before it. If it goes wrong the town will be...."was clear from day one the Yanks would leave us high and dry or its a shite league anyway and the club was over spending. Should have build a palace and I might have gone to 2 or 3 games a year." If it goes right "My club, sure dont I know them all.......live in Oriel....."
What many people in Dundalk forget, Dundalk FC costs a lot of money to run at the level it is at today and that money has to be earned not only on the pitch but also off it and has nothing to do with cash that is/was in the bank. Instead of questioning the people running the club or the amount of cash in the bank, why they didnt put a roof here there or anywhere, the people of Dundalk should be running up to Oriel, supporting as much as they can and hoping that with that support, slowly but surely things improve. With more income, the club would be in a position to improve facilities, the team....whatever. Maybe the 6-7K+ who go to the Aviva on Cup Final day or those who want those UEFA Cup/Champions League qualifier tickets should ask themselves why they are not in Oriel for every home game or why dont they have a season ticket even if they dont use it. Why does Ireland have so many event junkies??? These are the problem...they are fans when their is an event, a day out, afternoon in the pub, otherwise they ignore the club

Anyone who doesn't go to every Dundalk game is pathetic!! Lol. So what if people are event junkies. That's their prerogative. Its up to the club to attract new fans. How are these people 'the problem'????????

The brand and match day experience is obviously the problem, otherwise there would be many more fans attending.

Am I an event junkie if I watch the Wimbledon final but don't go down the ramparts to see some exciting local play junior tennis? Or if I go to the Irish Open but I don't go up to Dundalk golf club and watch a few locals play in the Senior Scratch Cup. Ridiculous stuff. People will come if they enjoy it. Otherwise they will spend their time and money somewhere else. That is what a logical person does, not a pathetic idiot who just doesn't get your love for the club.

Pepsi
Subs Bench
Subs Bench
Posts: 554
Joined: Thu Jan 03, 2019 10:21 pm

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Post by Pepsi » Thu Jun 04, 2020 8:29 pm

seand wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 6:19 pm
Pepsi wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 5:30 pm
My question is.....do the accounts reflect Euro money earned this year??? Surely nothing has been paid out as no compitition has ended. If that is the case and taking into account the investment in the YDC, it makes it all look a little different.
If Euro money is included in the loss, then questions have to be asked.

Any word on what Bill is supposed to say in the Argus with James Rogers about Oriel upgrades. Read somewhere on Twitter that they were readying some work....
I'm guessing Euro money for the 2018-19 season (Europa League v Levadia/AEK) would be reflected in 2019 accounts. That's a lot less that the 2019-20 Euro money, but still over 500K
If the loss is just over or around €500K I would be able to accept it as the club invested or claim to have invested in the YDC. That would suggest they are following a break even policy for the rest of the club......

Pepsi
Subs Bench
Subs Bench
Posts: 554
Joined: Thu Jan 03, 2019 10:21 pm

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Post by Pepsi » Thu Jun 04, 2020 8:48 pm

dundalkfc1903 wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 7:26 pm
People of Dundalk have to waken up.....Dundalk FC have a chance to do something never done before in Irish football, however if people/locally based companies are too narrow minded or tight fisted to support it, it will be like many attempts before it. If it goes wrong the town will be...."was clear from day one the Yanks would leave us high and dry or its a shite league anyway and the club was over spending. Should have build a palace and I might have gone to 2 or 3 games a year." If it goes right "My club, sure dont I know them all.......live in Oriel....."
What many people in Dundalk forget, Dundalk FC costs a lot of money to run at the level it is at today and that money has to be earned not only on the pitch but also off it and has nothing to do with cash that is/was in the bank. Instead of questioning the people running the club or the amount of cash in the bank, why they didnt put a roof here there or anywhere, the people of Dundalk should be running up to Oriel, supporting as much as they can and hoping that with that support, slowly but surely things improve. With more income, the club would be in a position to improve facilities, the team....whatever. Maybe the 6-7K+ who go to the Aviva on Cup Final day or those who want those UEFA Cup/Champions League qualifier tickets should ask themselves why they are not in Oriel for every home game or why dont they have a season ticket even if they dont use it. Why does Ireland have so many event junkies??? These are the problem...they are fans when their is an event, a day out, afternoon in the pub, otherwise they ignore the club

Anyone who doesn't go to every Dundalk game is pathetic!! Lol. So what if people are event junkies. That's their prerogative. Its up to the club to attract new fans. How are these people 'the problem'????????

The brand and match day experience is obviously the problem, otherwise there would be many more fans attending.

Am I an event junkie if I watch the Wimbledon final but don't go down the ramparts to see some exciting local play junior tennis? Or if I go to the Irish Open but I don't go up to Dundalk golf club and watch a few locals play in the Senior Scratch Cup. Ridiculous stuff. People will come if they enjoy it. Otherwise they will spend their time and money somewhere else. That is what a logical person does, not a pathetic idiot who just doesn't get your love for the club.
Dundalk FC is a professional club which needs financial support. You know when you pay for Sky where the money is going?? You got it, to the clubs in the UK or Scotland. LOI doesnt have that income, as a result they have to get the money at the gate or through merchandise sales. The day to day expenses have to be paid and the owners are targeting that, to provide a great team and break even. Event junkies are the ones who appear to maybe 2-3 games a year at Oriel, when the weather fits, the mates are up for it or they take the notion and cry the loudest when they dont get tickets for a key game which sells out. The same people will tell you they wouldnt watch and Ireland friendly but will be organising partys when Ireland play at the Euros or World Cup.......wouldnt know when Dundalk Rugby team plays or in which league they play, but want to support the national team and be in the Aviva when they play England for the 6 Nations, New Zealand or so on.
dundalkfc1903 wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 7:15 pm
For €20 per month I would want streaming of away games included. Few extra interviews isn't going to do it for me. I don't really watch or read post match interviews as its mostly cliché driven stuff that you hear after every game.
You do realise what streaming costs to setup, the infrastructure costs involved?? You also realise that the club have stated yesterday and today via numerous social media channels that the package will be added to....they announced what they can offer to fans now or in the near future. This is an attempt by the club to earn additional money, that money would be used to improve the club and brand as a whole. Dundalk FC and the LOI has been neglected for over 40+ years and the current owners are trying to change the current. Only if or when people get behind them will change happen, because like with everything in life, if money isnt earned nothing will improve or change. Football as a spectator sport....the income source needed is a solid regular attendace. Fans can invest today for better times tomorrow. As you mentioned.....the brand and match day being a problem......the brand could not be better, Champions of Ireland etc. etc., community friendly......match day experience....Oriel aint Anfield or Old Trafford but just about reflects what is possible with approx. 2,5-3K paying punters. What point is a great stadium with a first division team....would you come up to Oriel more often then??? The policy is clearly......shite stadium, with prospective of improvement with the best team in Ireland, increase in income, public financial support needed to carry out major work on a stadium which really needs a few KGs of semtex and a rebuild.

dundalkfc1903
1st Team Regular
1st Team Regular
Posts: 4171
Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2007 4:27 pm

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Post by dundalkfc1903 » Thu Jun 04, 2020 9:33 pm

Pepsi wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 8:48 pm
dundalkfc1903 wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 7:26 pm
People of Dundalk have to waken up.....Dundalk FC have a chance to do something never done before in Irish football, however if people/locally based companies are too narrow minded or tight fisted to support it, it will be like many attempts before it. If it goes wrong the town will be...."was clear from day one the Yanks would leave us high and dry or its a shite league anyway and the club was over spending. Should have build a palace and I might have gone to 2 or 3 games a year." If it goes right "My club, sure dont I know them all.......live in Oriel....."
What many people in Dundalk forget, Dundalk FC costs a lot of money to run at the level it is at today and that money has to be earned not only on the pitch but also off it and has nothing to do with cash that is/was in the bank. Instead of questioning the people running the club or the amount of cash in the bank, why they didnt put a roof here there or anywhere, the people of Dundalk should be running up to Oriel, supporting as much as they can and hoping that with that support, slowly but surely things improve. With more income, the club would be in a position to improve facilities, the team....whatever. Maybe the 6-7K+ who go to the Aviva on Cup Final day or those who want those UEFA Cup/Champions League qualifier tickets should ask themselves why they are not in Oriel for every home game or why dont they have a season ticket even if they dont use it. Why does Ireland have so many event junkies??? These are the problem...they are fans when their is an event, a day out, afternoon in the pub, otherwise they ignore the club

Anyone who doesn't go to every Dundalk game is pathetic!! Lol. So what if people are event junkies. That's their prerogative. Its up to the club to attract new fans. How are these people 'the problem'????????

The brand and match day experience is obviously the problem, otherwise there would be many more fans attending.

Am I an event junkie if I watch the Wimbledon final but don't go down the ramparts to see some exciting local play junior tennis? Or if I go to the Irish Open but I don't go up to Dundalk golf club and watch a few locals play in the Senior Scratch Cup. Ridiculous stuff. People will come if they enjoy it. Otherwise they will spend their time and money somewhere else. That is what a logical person does, not a pathetic idiot who just doesn't get your love for the club.
Dundalk FC is a professional club which needs financial support. You know when you pay for Sky where the money is going?? You got it, to the clubs in the UK or Scotland. LOI doesnt have that income, as a result they have to get the money at the gate or through merchandise sales. The day to day expenses have to be paid and the owners are targeting that, to provide a great team and break even. Event junkies are the ones who appear to maybe 2-3 games a year at Oriel, when the weather fits, the mates are up for it or they take the notion and cry the loudest when they dont get tickets for a key game which sells out. The same people will tell you they wouldnt watch and Ireland friendly but will be organising partys when Ireland play at the Euros or World Cup.......wouldnt know when Dundalk Rugby team plays or in which league they play, but want to support the national team and be in the Aviva when they play England for the 6 Nations, New Zealand or so on.
dundalkfc1903 wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 7:15 pm
For €20 per month I would want streaming of away games included. Few extra interviews isn't going to do it for me. I don't really watch or read post match interviews as its mostly cliché driven stuff that you hear after every game.
You do realise what streaming costs to setup, the infrastructure costs involved?? You also realise that the club have stated yesterday and today via numerous social media channels that the package will be added to....they announced what they can offer to fans now or in the near future. This is an attempt by the club to earn additional money, that money would be used to improve the club and brand as a whole. Dundalk FC and the LOI has been neglected for over 40+ years and the current owners are trying to change the current. Only if or when people get behind them will change happen, because like with everything in life, if money isnt earned nothing will improve or change. Football as a spectator sport....the income source needed is a solid regular attendace. Fans can invest today for better times tomorrow. As you mentioned.....the brand and match day being a problem......the brand could not be better, Champions of Ireland etc. etc., community friendly......match day experience....Oriel aint Anfield or Old Trafford but just about reflects what is possible with approx. 2,5-3K paying punters. What point is a great stadium with a first division team....would you come up to Oriel more often then??? The policy is clearly......shite stadium, with prospective of improvement with the best team in Ireland, increase in income, public financial support needed to carry out major work on a stadium which really needs a few KGs of semtex and a rebuild.
I don't need an education in the finances of the club. Its all fairly simple. We are so far from breaking even that membership schemes, ticket sales and merchandise is a drop in the ocean. I wasn't debating any of it, and dont have a particular interest in it. Thank you for the rant though, hopefully it made you feel better. I just took issue with your description of people who don't attend more often. Maybe they just dont like football as much as the 2,000 hardcore. Maybe they dont really care if DFC exists, its just foootball.

Maybe you could approach the club and encourage a flyer campaign
'Hi part time Dundalk supporter, we see you only bought a ticket for the cup final last year.
You are a pathetic day tripper, please come more often,
Thanks'.

Ezeikial
Club Captain
Club Captain
Posts: 7415
Joined: Wed Dec 10, 2008 1:00 am

Re: Official Takeover Thread

Post by Ezeikial » Thu Jun 04, 2020 9:40 pm

Pepsi wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 8:48 pm
Event junkies are the ones who appear to maybe 2-3 games a year at Oriel, when the weather fits, the mates are up for it or they take the notion and cry the loudest when they dont get tickets for a key game which sells out.
Have you ever considered that people who go to 2-3 games a year might be easier to persuade to go say 10 times a year then someone who does not go to Oriel at all?

Slagging them off is unlikely to be effective.

However trying to understand and address the barriers for casual/occasional supporters might be helpful..............
Ezeikial posts personal opinions and observations from this supporters perspective.

Post Reply