Dundalk v St. Pats.

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Re: Dundalk v St. Pats.

Post by GC. » Tue May 25, 2021 9:27 pm

Martin Lawlor80 wrote: Tue May 25, 2021 6:01 pm Yeah yeah we were one kick away from winning a treble and Peak6 have ripped everything good up apparently. Even if you believe all that, the performances in the league since last Summer have been disgraceful and as Ronan O’Gara said after his team lost the rugby champions league final “Excuses are for losers”. Bill hasn’t been on the pitch as far as I’ve seen and these players have stopped playing under 3 different managers. As I said yesterday, where is their pride??
JM said that he never played for a manager. Well I don’t agree with that. The best managers get their players to run through walls. But I do agree with him when he says that first and foremost you play for yourself, your teammates and your club. I have very little good to say about Roy Keane but the likes of him played for their own pride and let others know when they were letting the side down.
Where are the voices on the pitch? Who is looking after the standards that have been set??
Was it not true that all the players from last year were out of contract at the end of last season?
If things were so ‘toxic’ under Bill as fans keep saying, why did the majority of the squad sign up for another year?

This is NOT a defence of Peak6 and Bill , but as I said excuses are for losers
It's a sad reflection of the current state of Oriel Web that this has to be stated.

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Re: Dundalk v St. Pats.

Post by Louth4sam » Tue May 25, 2021 11:13 pm

GC. wrote: Tue May 25, 2021 9:14 pm
Louth4sam wrote: Tue May 25, 2021 3:51 pm
GC. wrote: Tue May 25, 2021 11:27 am

If you don’t like different opinions then maybe an Internet forum is not the best place to be. However, since you are here, if you actually go back and read my posts, I have been critical of the running of the club too. I would like you to back up where I called out fans for resisting change. If you actually read rather than react you will see that I said some people within organisations are resistant to change.

I was one of the first here to call out the players for non-performance. You’d have seen that since you remember all my posts. However, when you want a team to perform you don’t constantly be on their back. I have already said (if you read my posts as close as you think you do), you will see that I said it is possible to be critical, yet supportive. You actually quoted that post!

Please deal with facts when you are trying to attack someone for their posts, and their different opinions.
Unless I took this part of a previous post up wrong (and if I did I apologise), it seems to be you're suggesting that a fan here is resistant to change.
GC. wrote: Thu Apr 01, 2021 10:33 am It sounds like change is taking place and change can take time.

Your idea and my idea of devastating seem to be two different things. As I said earlier people react differently to change. I can see James and yourself in some of my colleagues and ex-colleagues.
You might say that you have been playing devil's advocate as we don't know with 100% certainty what is going on behind the scenes and that's fair enough but lets deal with facts like you've said. We are third from bottom in the league, have just lost 5-1 to a club that is struggling to score goals, we haven't had a manager in place in five weeks and there is no sign of one coming in, our next manager will be our 5th manager in little over a year, we are in real danger of missing out on European football and associated prize money, have fans protesting outside games, our director of football has just said he needs a clearout of the dressing room.

If your opinion is that in little under a year and a half we've gone from being the best team in the league beating everyone in our paths to an absolute basket case because some people within organisations are resistant to change, I feel your opinion needs to be attacked.
Firstly, you did not attack my opinion. You attacked me. The old thing on internet forums is to attack the post, and not the poster.

You have quoted me out of context. If you re-read the posts in that thread, you will hopefully understand what I was saying. It was about staff. Even the post you quoted states: "As I said earlier people react differently to change." I do find it extremely strange that some posters have latched onto the fact that some people are resistant to organisational change and try to use it as a point scoring exercise against me and a couple of others. It fails each time because they are trying to score points against something that is true. It is carried from thread to thread, and I'm sure it isn't fun for many people to read the same crap in so many places.

As for playing devils advocate, I don't think so. I just don't throw a tantrum when things don't go the way I wish. I also understand that there are multiple sides to the same story, and the most negative is usually the one that gets publicised. I don't claim to know things when I don't. I don't claim to hear something and take it as fact without knowing the full story. Many people these days react to headlines only, and don't want to know the story behind it. In many cases, the story is often different to the headline. I prefer to read past the headline. Maybe I have mellowed with age. I understand that Peak6 are a private company and really can do whatever they want with the club. They are the sole shareholders.

As for this year, I'd be thinking that it will be written off by Peak6 if the next manager doesn't make an instant impact and we make the European spots. It will be considered transitional, as changes obviously were made to the playing, coaching and other club staff, and the director of football has possibly spent more time on the training ground than doing his own job....and maybe even mean that part of the transition is Bill moving on when he has that awkward Xmas dinner conversation with his son.

The public comment JM made about the clear out is very unprofessional, and I wouldn't consider it good management. Like everyone here, I am curious to know what the hell is going on in the dressing room, but something has obviously happened in the dressing room unless he is a complete loon in saying that to the press. I don't have a clue which.

However, I stand by the need to support the team when they are on the pitch. Cheer them on, and don't abuse. After all, as Johnnybegood said earlier, they are humans.
I had a pretty long-winded post written but have just deleted as what's the point, we're never going to agree and will just end up going down a rabbit hole.

I'll just finish with, I don't have any faith that Bill or Peak6 aren't going to have us in the graveyard in a couple of years and I just hope that yourself and others are saying I told you so when my fears are unjustified and we are stable and competing.
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Re: Dundalk v St. Pats.

Post by GC. » Tue May 25, 2021 11:45 pm

Louth4sam wrote: Tue May 25, 2021 11:13 pm
GC. wrote: Tue May 25, 2021 9:14 pm
Louth4sam wrote: Tue May 25, 2021 3:51 pm

Unless I took this part of a previous post up wrong (and if I did I apologise), it seems to be you're suggesting that a fan here is resistant to change.



You might say that you have been playing devil's advocate as we don't know with 100% certainty what is going on behind the scenes and that's fair enough but lets deal with facts like you've said. We are third from bottom in the league, have just lost 5-1 to a club that is struggling to score goals, we haven't had a manager in place in five weeks and there is no sign of one coming in, our next manager will be our 5th manager in little over a year, we are in real danger of missing out on European football and associated prize money, have fans protesting outside games, our director of football has just said he needs a clearout of the dressing room.

If your opinion is that in little under a year and a half we've gone from being the best team in the league beating everyone in our paths to an absolute basket case because some people within organisations are resistant to change, I feel your opinion needs to be attacked.
Firstly, you did not attack my opinion. You attacked me. The old thing on internet forums is to attack the post, and not the poster.

You have quoted me out of context. If you re-read the posts in that thread, you will hopefully understand what I was saying. It was about staff. Even the post you quoted states: "As I said earlier people react differently to change." I do find it extremely strange that some posters have latched onto the fact that some people are resistant to organisational change and try to use it as a point scoring exercise against me and a couple of others. It fails each time because they are trying to score points against something that is true. It is carried from thread to thread, and I'm sure it isn't fun for many people to read the same crap in so many places.

As for playing devils advocate, I don't think so. I just don't throw a tantrum when things don't go the way I wish. I also understand that there are multiple sides to the same story, and the most negative is usually the one that gets publicised. I don't claim to know things when I don't. I don't claim to hear something and take it as fact without knowing the full story. Many people these days react to headlines only, and don't want to know the story behind it. In many cases, the story is often different to the headline. I prefer to read past the headline. Maybe I have mellowed with age. I understand that Peak6 are a private company and really can do whatever they want with the club. They are the sole shareholders.

As for this year, I'd be thinking that it will be written off by Peak6 if the next manager doesn't make an instant impact and we make the European spots. It will be considered transitional, as changes obviously were made to the playing, coaching and other club staff, and the director of football has possibly spent more time on the training ground than doing his own job....and maybe even mean that part of the transition is Bill moving on when he has that awkward Xmas dinner conversation with his son.

The public comment JM made about the clear out is very unprofessional, and I wouldn't consider it good management. Like everyone here, I am curious to know what the hell is going on in the dressing room, but something has obviously happened in the dressing room unless he is a complete loon in saying that to the press. I don't have a clue which.

However, I stand by the need to support the team when they are on the pitch. Cheer them on, and don't abuse. After all, as Johnnybegood said earlier, they are humans.
I had a pretty long-winded post written but have just deleted as what's the point, we're never going to agree and will just end up going down a rabbit hole.

I'll just finish with, I don't have any faith that Bill or Peak6 aren't going to have us in the graveyard in a couple of years and I just hope that yourself and others are saying I told you so when my fears are unjustified and we are stable and competing.
I suppose I’ll wait by the letterbox for the postman to call with a card with an apology for the personal attacks. Good luck with the supporters club. You have done it great disservice from your attacks here on people who aren’t singing your tune.

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Re: Dundalk v St. Pats.

Post by Richie87 » Wed May 26, 2021 12:13 am

Martin Lawlor80 wrote: Tue May 25, 2021 6:01 pm Yeah yeah we were one kick away from winning a treble and Peak6 have ripped everything good up apparently. Even if you believe all that, the performances in the league since last Summer have been disgraceful and as Ronan O’Gara said after his team lost the rugby champions league final “Excuses are for losers”. Bill hasn’t been on the pitch as far as I’ve seen and these players have stopped playing under 3 different managers. As I said yesterday, where is their pride??
JM said that he never played for a manager. Well I don’t agree with that. The best managers get their players to run through walls. But I do agree with him when he says that first and foremost you play for yourself, your teammates and your club. I have very little good to say about Roy Keane but the likes of him played for their own pride and let others know when they were letting the side down.
Where are the voices on the pitch? Who is looking after the standards that have been set??
Was it not true that all the players from last year were out of contract at the end of last season?
If things were so ‘toxic’ under Bill as fans keep saying, why did the majority of the squad sign up for another year?

This is NOT a defence of Peak6 and Bill , but as I said excuses are for losers
There was a few from last year contracted for this season. Boyle, McEleney, Slogget Leahy, Shields,Hoban.

In fairness it's either Dundalk or Shamrock Rovers who pay the best wages,so even if Bill H was being disruptive, they might not have got as good a salary In the League.

Michael Duffy had the opportunity to go to Huddersfield but signed on a rolling contract

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Re: Dundalk v St. Pats.

Post by Louth4sam » Wed May 26, 2021 7:53 am

GC. wrote: Tue May 25, 2021 11:45 pm
Louth4sam wrote: Tue May 25, 2021 11:13 pm
GC. wrote: Tue May 25, 2021 9:14 pm

Firstly, you did not attack my opinion. You attacked me. The old thing on internet forums is to attack the post, and not the poster.

You have quoted me out of context. If you re-read the posts in that thread, you will hopefully understand what I was saying. It was about staff. Even the post you quoted states: "As I said earlier people react differently to change." I do find it extremely strange that some posters have latched onto the fact that some people are resistant to organisational change and try to use it as a point scoring exercise against me and a couple of others. It fails each time because they are trying to score points against something that is true. It is carried from thread to thread, and I'm sure it isn't fun for many people to read the same crap in so many places.

As for playing devils advocate, I don't think so. I just don't throw a tantrum when things don't go the way I wish. I also understand that there are multiple sides to the same story, and the most negative is usually the one that gets publicised. I don't claim to know things when I don't. I don't claim to hear something and take it as fact without knowing the full story. Many people these days react to headlines only, and don't want to know the story behind it. In many cases, the story is often different to the headline. I prefer to read past the headline. Maybe I have mellowed with age. I understand that Peak6 are a private company and really can do whatever they want with the club. They are the sole shareholders.

As for this year, I'd be thinking that it will be written off by Peak6 if the next manager doesn't make an instant impact and we make the European spots. It will be considered transitional, as changes obviously were made to the playing, coaching and other club staff, and the director of football has possibly spent more time on the training ground than doing his own job....and maybe even mean that part of the transition is Bill moving on when he has that awkward Xmas dinner conversation with his son.

The public comment JM made about the clear out is very unprofessional, and I wouldn't consider it good management. Like everyone here, I am curious to know what the hell is going on in the dressing room, but something has obviously happened in the dressing room unless he is a complete loon in saying that to the press. I don't have a clue which.

However, I stand by the need to support the team when they are on the pitch. Cheer them on, and don't abuse. After all, as Johnnybegood said earlier, they are humans.
I had a pretty long-winded post written but have just deleted as what's the point, we're never going to agree and will just end up going down a rabbit hole.

I'll just finish with, I don't have any faith that Bill or Peak6 aren't going to have us in the graveyard in a couple of years and I just hope that yourself and others are saying I told you so when my fears are unjustified and we are stable and competing.
I suppose I’ll wait by the letterbox for the postman to call with a card with an apology for the personal attacks. Good luck with the supporters club. You have done it great disservice from your attacks here on people who aren’t singing your tune.
You won't get an apology as I stand by what I said. I quoted where you called out Jim and another fan for resisting change. "I see ex colleagues in Jim and yourself" and you ignored this. You've tried to put over an alternative view of why Peak6 are doing the things they are doing when the reality is the complete opposite.

I have nothing to do with the supporters club more than having them intention of signing up as a regular member it is as much your supporters club as mine.
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Re: Dundalk v St. Pats.

Post by GC. » Wed May 26, 2021 8:57 am

Louth4sam wrote: Wed May 26, 2021 7:53 am
GC. wrote: Tue May 25, 2021 11:45 pm
Louth4sam wrote: Tue May 25, 2021 11:13 pm

I had a pretty long-winded post written but have just deleted as what's the point, we're never going to agree and will just end up going down a rabbit hole.

I'll just finish with, I don't have any faith that Bill or Peak6 aren't going to have us in the graveyard in a couple of years and I just hope that yourself and others are saying I told you so when my fears are unjustified and we are stable and competing.
I suppose I’ll wait by the letterbox for the postman to call with a card with an apology for the personal attacks. Good luck with the supporters club. You have done it great disservice from your attacks here on people who aren’t singing your tune.
You won't get an apology as I stand by what I said. I quoted where you called out Jim and another fan for resisting change. "I see ex colleagues in Jim and yourself" and you ignored this. You've tried to put over an alternative view of why Peak6 are doing the things they are doing when the reality is the complete opposite.

I have nothing to do with the supporters club more than having them intention of signing up as a regular member it is as much your supporters club as mine.
You don’t know the facts, and neither do I, but you jump to conclusions, whereas I don’t. If you want an echo chamber go to Twitter. I will support the team that you seem to have given up on, because you even argued against showing support for the players when they are on the pitch. I’m disappointed with the league position, and performances, but I haven’t given up on the team. I think this season can be salvaged with the right manager in place, and JM getting to do his role of DoF. I’m quite sure that Peak6 didn’t get involved to make things worse, because that would make no sense. It’s obvious that the major error they made this season was to appoint FG. He should have remained as a stop gap after VP was sacked, and he was a successful stop gap I tilt he end of last season.

You can read what you like into my posts, as you clearly have already. It doesn’t mean that you understand the message I presented. I accept fault for that as I am the sender of the communication, but you can always question a post rather than let it fester and then lash out in future. After all they are only words on a screen from a stranger (but maybe not a stranger). I’m done with this drama, and I’ll go back to ignoring people who mention ‘resistance to change’ as a point scoring exercise because they don’t want to see another side of a discussion. I’m not into drama like that.

One last thing I’ll say though, and then I’m done with this exchange. In future please be an adult and don’t attack people, attack posts. In the end we all should be on the same team albeit with different views.

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Re: Dundalk v St. Pats.

Post by Pepsi » Wed May 26, 2021 9:09 am

Lads I think none of us can draw conclusions on what is going on in Oriel until we know what exactly the internal investigation is about. I have been told 2 things which may be the reason for investigation (sources OK but not 100% so I am not going to make them public here), if either are true people will understand why they are doing what they are doing and thank them for doing it. It is also the reason I have said from day 1 that there are two sides to every story, something Vinny has come out and proved.

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Re: Dundalk v St. Pats.

Post by Louth4sam » Wed May 26, 2021 9:18 am

GC. wrote: Wed May 26, 2021 8:57 am
Louth4sam wrote: Wed May 26, 2021 7:53 am
GC. wrote: Tue May 25, 2021 11:45 pm

I suppose I’ll wait by the letterbox for the postman to call with a card with an apology for the personal attacks. Good luck with the supporters club. You have done it great disservice from your attacks here on people who aren’t singing your tune.
You won't get an apology as I stand by what I said. I quoted where you called out Jim and another fan for resisting change. "I see ex colleagues in Jim and yourself" and you ignored this. You've tried to put over an alternative view of why Peak6 are doing the things they are doing when the reality is the complete opposite.

I have nothing to do with the supporters club more than having them intention of signing up as a regular member it is as much your supporters club as mine.
You don’t know the facts, and neither do I, but you jump to conclusions, whereas I don’t. If you want an echo chamber go to Twitter. I will support the team that you seem to have given up on, because you even argued against showing support for the players when they are on the pitch. I’m disappointed with the league position, and performances, but I haven’t given up on the team. I think this season can be salvaged with the right manager in place, and JM getting to do his role of DoF. I’m quite sure that Peak6 didn’t get involved to make things worse, because that would make no sense. It’s obvious that the major error they made this season was to appoint FG. He should have remained as a stop gap after VP was sacked, and he was a successful stop gap I tilt he end of last season.

You can read what you like into my posts, as you clearly have already. It doesn’t mean that you understand the message I presented. I accept fault for that as I am the sender of the communication, but you can always question a post rather than let it fester and then lash out in future. After all they are only words on a screen from a stranger (but maybe not a stranger). I’m done with this drama, and I’ll go back to ignoring people who mention ‘resistance to change’ as a point scoring exercise because they don’t want to see another side of a discussion. I’m not into drama like that.

One last thing I’ll say though, and then I’m done with this exchange. In future please be an adult and don’t attack people, attack posts. In the end we all should be on the same team albeit with different views.
Don't attack the people attack the post???

"but you jump to conclusions, whereas I don’t"
"I will support the team that you seem to have given up on"

In your own post you've accused me of arguing against showing support on the pitch? I never said this I called you out for saying the protest should be replaced with "a celebration with positivity outside the next home". The protest has nothing to do with the players as you seem to be suggesting that the negativity of protests is having an impact.
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Re: Dundalk v St. Pats.

Post by GC. » Wed May 26, 2021 9:24 am

Pepsi wrote: Wed May 26, 2021 9:09 am Lads I think none of us can draw conclusions on what is going on in Oriel until we know what exactly the internal investigation is about. I have been told 2 things which may be the reason for investigation (sources OK but not 100% so I am not going to make them public here), if either are true people will understand why they are doing what they are doing and thank them for doing it. It is also the reason I have said from day 1 that there are two sides to every story, something Vinny has come out and proved.
I know nothing about the investigation apart from the titbit posted on this forum. It’s an internal company investigation, so unless it results in a court case we may never hear the full story. Yes, you’ve been consistent with saying that there’s more than one side to every story. Sorry for your troubles since 😛😂

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Re: Dundalk v St. Pats.

Post by Louth4sam » Wed May 26, 2021 9:33 am

Pepsi wrote: Wed May 26, 2021 9:09 am Lads I think none of us can draw conclusions on what is going on in Oriel until we know what exactly the internal investigation is about. I have been told 2 things which may be the reason for investigation (sources OK but not 100% so I am not going to make them public here), if either are true people will understand why they are doing what they are doing and thank them for doing it. It is also the reason I have said from day 1 that there are two sides to every story, something Vinny has come out and proved.
From what you're hinting at, it sounds similar to what I've heard. If true, it would certainly give an understanding on some of the decisions over the last few months that have irked some supporters. (decisions I don't disagree and haven't disagreed with).
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Re: Dundalk v St. Pats.

Post by Alrightourfella » Fri May 28, 2021 1:48 pm

Getting back to tonights game and going on our last result we could be in for a long night but hopefully we can get something from the game and show some fight at least we desperately need a win.

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Re: Dundalk v St. Pats.

Post by GC. » Fri May 28, 2021 2:34 pm

I wonder how many of the last line up will start. Surely there has to be some players dropped. I wouldn't have liked to be in the dressing room after the last game. It will also be interesting to see how the players react. I hope it is positively, and we get the win.

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Re: Dundalk v St. Pats.

Post by dundalkfc1903 » Fri May 28, 2021 2:56 pm

I would bring Sonia Hoey into the dressing room before kick off and let her tell these guys how privileged they are to be young, fit , healthy and to be able to play and earn a living from a game the love.

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Re: Dundalk v St. Pats.

Post by BigChief » Fri May 28, 2021 2:59 pm

Id go with the following
Gerry Malone
Raivis, Shields, Boyle, Leahy
Slogett
Stanton McEleney
Duffy Hoban Kelly

If Hoban is any way fit he has to start. Cant see Pats not scoring tonight.
Surely it cant be any worse than Monday night.

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Re: Dundalk v St. Pats.

Post by seand » Fri May 28, 2021 3:41 pm

BigChief wrote: Fri May 28, 2021 2:59 pm Id go with the following
Gerry Malone
Raivis, Shields, Boyle, Leahy
Slogett
Stanton McEleney
Duffy Hoban Kelly

If Hoban is any way fit he has to start. Cant see Pats not scoring tonight.
Surely it cant be any worse than Monday night.
You've gone and jinxed it now

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